Situation Help???, Not able to see strike. Options

[flygreg]

Have a bunch of carp located. Most are suspended and stationary over deep water. Have not been successful with them. On fringes 3-4 foot of water see several fish working the bottom. Here is the problem: Water is dingy enough you can make out shape and see movement, but can't see enough detail to see strike, gill flare, etc. Have managed a couple fish and foul hooked a couple (setting hook on what I thought was a take). I feel like the fish are probably sucking up the fly, but can't be sure.
Anyone have thoughts on how to see or feel the take better? Have not tried an indicator, but considering that option. Thinking indicator might almost work like a small bobber and emphasize line movement. Anyone with experience in that area?

PS - My first attempt at posting. Hope this works out.

THANKS!!!!

[john montana]

I've used indicators in rivers where you can drift a fly, they work. If you can see any shape at all though, i'd stick with no indicator. try to put the fly to the side of the fish, and then set the hook when the shape changes position. Pretty tough spot from the sound of it!

[phonebush]

flygreg,

First, WELCOME TO THE CAG BOARD ! !
Your post came through loud and clear.

John, is a really successful carp flyfisherman. Listen to him.

I have only limited experience with your delimma. When it did occur the few times I've fly fished I was told to use "artifical trash" as my indicator. Seemed to work the few time I've used it.

Phone

[Windknot]

I fish what sounds like very similar water. I used John's advice to watch for movement towards the fly and slowly strip the fly and if I feel resistance I strip harder to set the hook. I have to admit that I don't hook all that many but to me that is part of the allure of fishing for carp. When you catch one on a fly you know that you have accomplished something.

[Lee Baermann]

If you are using a floating line, let the spot where your leader meets the fly line be your indicator. I fish nothing but muddy water and I use this system, if its a system, and it works for me. When you twitch the fly back towards you, watch that spot. If it stops, side strike, if it keeps coming back towards you, repeat as needed.

Also try to key in on the carp's back if you can see it. There appears to be a thin black line down the middle, all fish seem to have this silhouette, and I'll watch for any movement other then the direction it was previously traveling.

The more you fish and try these techniques, the easier it'll get. I've taught them to my clients and a good buddy and he catches as many as I do now.

[Eich]

If you are using a floating line, let the spot where your leader meets the fly line be your indicator. I fish nothing but muddy water and I use this system, if its a system, and it works for me. When you twitch the fly back towards you, watch that spot. If it stops, side strike, if it keeps coming back towards you, repeat as needed.

Also try to key in on the carp's back if you can see it. There appears to be a thin black line down the middle, all fish seem to have this silhouette, and I'll watch for any movement other then the direction it was previously traveling.

The more you fish and try these techniques, the easier it'll get. I've taught them to my clients and a good buddy and he catches as many as I do now.

Very sound advice! I agree 100%.

Ray

[flygreg]

Want to thank all for your suggestions. Wind was real bad in the area today so I couldn't really test the plan. I haven't had to fish this deep before or at least with dingy water to deal with at the same time. THANKS AGAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Clay34]

If the water is very murky use this to your advantage and get close to the fish if possible. I just don't see takes as far as line movement so indicators wouldn't be for me, I also don't feel strikes. I like your comment on setting the hook when you think it is right. I just finished watching a czech nymphing video and they were fishing grayling. A guy on the US fly fishing team was given a place to fish and told the fish are they go catch them. He fish for a bit of time with no or little success. The guy that was teaching him Vladi, a world champion polish nympher, came down and took the rod away from him and caught grayling on his first cast. When the US team guy asked him how he did that he went on to tell a story about knowing where the fish are and setting the hook when the fish should have eaten the fly if a fish was going to eat the fly. Now what does grayling fishing have to do with carp fishing?

You are close to the carp, position the fly where it will be on the feeding end of the fish and when it doubt hook set! I think that you are absolutely right in that you are probably getting bit, but don't recognize it as a bite and therefore miss fish. John's comments on watching the fish change position is a key point. Lee is a master at fishing in the muddy stuff. I like to key in on somehting that I can see and take the visual ques to hook set. Keep at it and hook set often. Remember that carp don't eat with their tails. Not trying to be funny, just trying to empasize that the hook has to not only be close to the fish, but be close to the eating end of the fish.

Rick

[Windknot]

Clay34 your post reminds me of a video I saw a couple of years ago. They used underwater cameras to watch nymphs as fisherman fished them. They found that the vast majority of strikes were missed by even the best nymph fisherman. If I see the fish close to where I believe my fly to be I do a slow strip set and set stronger if I feel resistance. The problem is spooking the fish if they feel the leader or the unnatural movement of the fly.

[MajorGeek]

Those stationary fish over deep water are unlikely to bite a fly. Not good prospects. They are basking. When you find them like that they just want to nap. Try earlier in the day before the surface water heats up. Try to find where they feed on the way to the basking areas. Try to feed them along the shores before they head for the sleeping areas. What you are looking for is carp head down, tail up in shallow enough areas where your fly can get to the bottom right in front of their noses.

In most cases (not when fishing the mulberry hatch), you need to minimize the splash down of your nymph. An indicator will likely just make the splash down worse, spooking feeding fish. Indicators also make it harder to get distance with your casts when you need it.

[Driftless]

I have yet to use this for carp, as my carp scouting this year has been frustrating, but for a indicator that will not be too obvious and spook fish:

[flygreg]

I have yet to use this for carp, as my carp scouting this year has been frustrating, but for a indicator that will not be too obvious and spook fish:

I read the attached article. Very interesting! My immediate reaction was that one would need to scale up the size. Did you have thoughts or have you tried anything as far as carp preparation.

[roughfisher]

I have yet to use this for carp, as my carp scouting this year has been frustrating, but for a indicator that will not be too obvious and spook fish:

definitely a unique innovative approach to indicator fishing that should be closer examined. thanks for sharing the article link Mat.

[CreekAddict]

I use the curly sighter for euro nymphing to trout. It's super sensitive. I've been using it for about a year now, and there is no better alternative when it comes to tight lining fish.

[flygreg]

I use the curly sighter for euro nymphing to trout. It's super sensitive. I've been using it for about a year now, and there is no better alternative when it comes to tight lining fish.

Have you used 6# line to make your curly sighter or have you used other weights just as effectively? I haven't tried to make any as of yet. Do you have any opinion on how it might work for carp? I was a bit concerned as most of my nymphs are weighted to a greater degree than what I feel you are talking with trout nymphs. THANKS!