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Guest AnthonyR

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Guest AnthonyR

After hearing about my great grandfather, who was an avid fly-fisherman, I decided that I want to take up fly fishing, starting next spring. (although i dont even know how to flycast) So naturallly I have few questions.

1. What is a decent low-price fly rod

2. What is a good low-price reel

3. What flies should I use for carp

4. What flies for salmon?

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Guest AnthonyR

1 more question( a stupid question that probably requires a complicated answer)

How does the line work? IE which type of line goes on first, second and third.

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Quite a few things come to mind to try to answer all of your questions, but here goes. First of all is there a Bass Pro Shop in your area? They have been very helpful to me in fly casting technique, fly tying classes, fly selection as well as general advice which us beginners need. All of this for the low price of FREE! Naturally the fly tying class is just a primer to teach you the basics of tying, but you have to start somewhere.

If there is not a Bass Pro Shop in your area do not despair. There are books as well as internet sites for fly fishing as well as fly tying. A good basic book is one titled "Fly Fishing for Dummies". This book is very easy reading and easy to understand. It can answer all of your questions about fly fishing in general.

Next I'll try to get you started on some basic patterns for carp. There's a saying in fly fishing that goes "Match the hatch" meaning that whatever the fish are feeding on in that particular area, try to match it with your fly pattern. If you fish parks where people feed the ducks with bread and the carp eat the bread too then you need a pattern that resembles a small piece of bread. A glo bug pattern in white would fill the bill here. (Note: the Glo Bug is actually considered a salmon/steelhead pattern). The Clouser Crayfish is another good pattern. Wolley buggers, muddler minnows and the San Juan Worm are also patterns for carp.

Any outfit designed for a number 8 fly line should be good for carp. I was fortunate and found a fly rod, reel, fly line and backing at a yard sale for $2.00.

The order of lines is first the backing, then the fly line, then the leader/tippet material. Hope this helps. Any other questions just ask and I'm sure that someone here on the board will be glad to help. There are many more knowledgeable than me! Tight lines and good luck! :D

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If you think you can make it to Lowell next year at some point, I can think of two people off the top of my head who enjoy fly fishing for carp. vinnyhas2manynames is one of these people (he's still a beginner though) and another guy (who is not a member of CAG).

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Braided Dacron backing is the best backing. Because... That's what it's made for. :D

Also, if you need a good beginner fly rod, get a Redington. I have one and it is freakin awesome. Beautiful, crisp, and light as a feather. The Red Start models are the best. About $160, but you can get them on sale for 80 if you look hard.

Also, If you break it, they'll fix it for you for twenty bucks, no questions asked.

Best advice: DON'T GO FOR A LOW PRICE ROD!!!! They cast awfully. It's soooo much easier if you have even a decent rod. I learned this the hard way.

Feel free to save money on the reel, just make sure it has a good drag. As in, it won't melt when a carp runs.

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Guest AnthonyR

thats a little steep ofr my price range. My plan is to get a really cheap one, just to learn and see if I like it, and then as I get more experienced, buy a good one.

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Guest AnthonyR

THis might be impossible, but probably about $70 for rod/reel combo. Like I said, im not looking for a top of the line reel and rod. Yet. I dont need features like drag(i dont use drag anyway), or ultra-far casting(i could practically throw a dry fly across the river i fish in), or large line capacity(no wity coment here)

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If you just want to try it out, find a friend that will let you borrow their equipment.

Its not worth wasting money on a cheap combo.

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You can get a decent rod for $50. It will be a relatively slow action, but unless you are casting into a 30 mph head wind, it will serve you well. both Okuma and Cortland put out an excellent line of entry level rods...a Cortland puts out some package combo's that are very inexpensive..but cast very well, for what they are.

Cortland 333 line is inexpensive but good, as is Scientific Anglers system 1 line(if you can still find it).

Okuma puts out some GREAT mid level reels...some as low as $30 WITH a full teflon disc drag. Not as nice as my Reddingtong AL large Arbour(why they stopped making that, I 'll never figure out!), but very good for the money.

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Guest AnthonyR

One more thing. Does anybody know of a good website geared towards the basics of fly fishing in general. THe ones I have seen are way to advanced. Im really a begginer. Im clueless as to how to cast, retrieve, tie flies etc. Any good sites?

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http://www4.sympatico.ca/ianjames/ask.html

http://www.flyfisherman.com/midwest/dwcarp/

http://www.msu.edu/~connert/carpfly.htm

http://www.about-flyfishing.com/cs/subject.phtml?cid=84

http://www.flyfisherman.com/midwest/dwcarp/index5.html

Hi Frank,

Here's some websites I found helpful-- I started fly for carp april 2005-- I'm addicted-- lot of hiking,, frustration, .... and oh yeah--- thrills!

Ben

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Guest AnthonyR

Thanks for the sites!

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Another site worth checking is FlyAnglersOnline. Great stufff.

I picked up a Cortland combo for my son last summer. I believe it was $35 for rod reel and line. It will deliver a fly nicely.

Lux

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Guest AnthonyR
Another site worth checking is FlyAnglersOnline.  Great stufff.

I picked up a Cortland combo for my son last summer.  I believe it was $35 for rod reel and line.  It will deliver a fly nicely.

Lux

Great website! WHere did you get that combo? Thats an excelent deal

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Guest catdaddy

ditto

http://www.flyanglersonline.com/begin/101/

taught me everything i need to know to get started.

here's what i wound up with to begin

(there are lots of fine manufactuers, it's easy to get good gear at a fair price so this is not an ad, just telling you what i did)

1. Temple Fork Outfitters signature series 2 piece 9' 7wt rod

2. Ocuma 7-8 wt fly reel

3. Scientific Anglers weight forward floating fly line

4. backing, leader, tippet a few flies

5. my favorite fly is the olive wooly booger on a #6 hook

$165 @ sportsman's warehouse

(less than my favorite baitcaster and reel btw)

My target is redfish but i've come to love carp on the fly rod also.

basically the differance is that with conventional gear you throw the lure and it carries the line where as in fly fishing, you throw the line and it carries the lure.

the idea is to get the line to stretch straight out behind you so you can snap the tip (much like snapping a towel) and get the line to stretch out in front of you to your target. the weight of the line "loads" or bends the rod on the backcast and then carries the fly with it on the foward cast. when you get it right you can feel the line accelerate as it gets farther away from you because more of it's weight is moving down range.

with a spinning rod you can cast a 1oz plug farther than a .5oz plug. but with flies, you don't even need a lure at all to cast. the heavier the fly the harder it is to handle. i practice with a piece of yarn as a "fly" so i don't have to worry about hooking myself as i learn.

the fly line will have different contures and profiles for different conditions

some cut the wind, some float, some sink, some are easier to cast with very little line out on the back cast so they might be the ticket if you have trees behind you etc.

ie: weight forward floating is a line that floats and has extra weight in the front part of the line to help you cast with less line out.

another big differance is what is a leader.

in conventional gear a leader is a piece of line added to the main line for one reason or another usually to keep the line from being cut by toothy fish or sharp gills or heavy cover.

fly leader is a length of tapered mono that is made to gradually bring the diameter of the line down from the diameter of the fly line to the size of the eye of the hook.

the 2 main purposes for this leader is to 1) transfer the power of the cast GENTLY to the fly and 2) to wind up with line that will fit through the eye of the hook.

some are premade and extruded from a single piece of mono.

that is called a knotless leader

you can make your own leader buy tying reducing lengths of smaller and smaller weight mono.

ie: 6' of 30#, 3' of 20#, and then 1.5-2' of12#

the leader is not tied to the hook. you ty in another piece of mono that is what ever pound test you are trying to fish with and you ty your fly to that. this is called a tippett. (most knotless leaders include 4-5' of tippett)

tippet is inexpensive and we use it so we can retie new flies over and over without cutting on the leader.

so again, a leader is tapered, a tippet is level end to end.

the main thing to remember is that somewhere between your fly line and your fly there needs to be a piece of mono that is LIGHTER test than your flyline. this so your tippet will be what breaks to keep you from loosing your fly line.

your basic rig is

fly

tippet- length as needed

leader- variable depends on flyline to tippet class ratio and conditions

flyline- typically around 85'

backing- typically 50 yards of dacron that is the same weight as the fly line

more backing optional

since i use my rig in saltwater and target fish that are perfectly capable of spooling me at any time, i load alot of line.

i have an 85' 20# test fly line backed by 25 yards of 20# dacron backed by 225yards of 20# power pro.

(lord help me if i ever have to reel in all that with a 1:1 ratio fly reel :D )

which brings us to the other big differance, what the reel is for.

with conventional gear you cast out the line and then reel it all back on to the reel.

rinse, lather, repeat.

a fly reels main job is to hold the line for you while you go from place to place.

while your fishing, you will pull or "strip" line from the reel and then cast it to your target, strip the line back in to a point where the fly is out of the strike zone and then you'll pick up the line w/ the rod tip, snap the tip to make it go out behind you then snap it forward to put it right back where you want it.

a good fly fisherman can make several casts to a stump for example while a baitcaster puts his bait there for a second then drags it all the way back in.

when you get hooked up your going to fight the fish with the line in your hand for the most part. occasionally you will need to "put the fish on the reel" which means all the slack is either taken out by the running fish or reeled up onto the reel so that you can use the drag on the reel to put measured pressure on the fish just like conventional gear.

most reels are 1:1 direct drive which means, one crank on the handle = one complete turn of the reel. this also means that if a fish takes off on you the reel handle will spin and it can bust your knuckles pretty good if your not careful. :D

more basics:

what is 6,7,8 weight etc etc?

the fly line has a basic physical weight to length ratio each with a different diameter. the rest of the gear is balanced to handle a certain "weight"

the value is expressed as a number from 1 to 14 one being the lightest.

what are all the hook numbers??

damd if i know but the higher the number the smaller the hook until you get to size 1 then it goes to 1/0 2/0 etc.

how do i know what size hook and tippet?

there are formulas to figure this out but if you know either what pound test tippet OR what size hook you are using you can figure out the other value.

the tippets and leaders are labeld as 4x, 5x,6x etc with the higher the number being the smaller diameter.

11,000th" diameter = 0x, 10k" =1x and so on.

(it comes from a sick attempt to avoid use of the metric system)

divide hook size by 4 and the ad 1 to get you close to the diameter you need.

ie: #6 hook 6/4=1 1+1=2 so for a #6 hook you want to start around a 2x diameter tippet, which then should be tied to a 2x leader that is tapered up to the fly line size.

check the label on the tippet to see what pound test it is and size your hook, tippet, leader combo to work with the test strength you think you need for your target fish.

i don't know if this helps you but if it does great.

it helped me to type it all out just to organize my thoughts. :D

my only real piece of advice to you is to not wait til spring, 15minutes a day of practice on good fundamentals will turn you into a decent fly fisherman in 2 or 3 weeks give or take and it would not hurt to get a lesson or 2 along the way.

an instuctor will also be able to help you sort what to get for your first rig and you'll be ready fish in the spring.

Edited by rexracer

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Guest AnthonyR
ditto

http://www.flyanglersonline.com/begin/101/

taught me everything i need to know to get started.

here's what i wound up with to begin

(there are lots of fine manufactuers, it's easy to get good gear at a fair price so this is not an ad, just telling you what i did)

1. Temple Fork Outfitters signature series 2 piece 9' 7wt rod

2. Ocuma 7-8 wt fly reel

3. Scientific Anglers weight forward floating fly line

4. backing, leader, tippet a few flies

5. my favorite fly is the olive wooly booger on a #6 hook

$165 @ sportsman's warehouse

(less than my favorite baitcaster and reel btw)

My target is redfish but i've come to love carp on the fly rod also.

basically the differance is that with conventional gear you throw the lure and it carries the line where as in fly fishing, you throw the line and it carries the lure.

the idea is to get the line to stretch straight out behind you so you can snap the tip (much like snapping a towel) and get the line to stretch out in front of you to your target. the weight of the line "loads" or bends the rod on the backcast and then carries the fly with it on the foward cast. when you get it right you can feel the line accelerate as it gets farther away from you because more of it's weight is moving down range.

with a spinning rod you can cast a 1oz plug farther than a .5oz plug. but with flies, you don't even need a lure at all to cast. the heavier the fly the harder it is to handle. i practice with a piece of yarn as a "fly" so i don't have to worry about hooking myself as i learn.

the fly line will have different contures and profiles for different conditions

some cut the wind, some float, some sink, some are easier to cast with very little line out on the back cast so they might be the ticket if you have trees behind you etc.

ie: weight forward floating is a line that floats and has extra weight in the front part of the line to help you cast with less line out.

another big differance is what is a leader.

in conventional gear a leader is a piece of line added to the main line for one reason or another usually to keep the line from being cut by toothy fish or sharp gills or heavy cover.

fly leader is a length of tapered mono that is made to gradually bring the diameter of the line down from the diameter of the fly line to the size of the eye of the hook.

the 2 main purposes for this leader is to 1) transfer the power of the cast GENTLY to the fly and 2) to wind up with line that will fit through the eye of the hook.

some are premade and extruded from a single piece of mono.

that is called a knotless leader

you can make your own leader buy tying reducing lengths of smaller and smaller weight mono.

ie: 6' of 30#, 3' of 20#, and then 1.5-2' of12#

the leader is not tied to the hook. you ty in another piece of mono that is what ever pound test you are trying to fish with and you ty your fly to that. this is called a tippett. (most knotless leaders include 4-5' of tippett)

tippet is inexpensive and we use it so we can retie new flies over and over without cutting on the leader.

so again, a leader is tapered, a tippet is level end to end.

the main thing to remember is that somewhere between your fly line and your fly there needs to be a piece of mono that is LIGHTER test than your flyline. this so your tippet will be what breaks to keep you from loosing your fly line.

your basic rig is

fly

tippet-  length as needed

leader- variable depends on flyline to tippet class ratio and conditions

flyline- typically around 85'

backing- typically 50 yards of dacron that is the same weight as the fly line

more backing optional

since i use my rig in saltwater and target fish that are perfectly capable of spooling me at any time, i load alot of line.

i have an 85' 20# test fly line backed by 25 yards of 20# dacron backed by 225yards of 20# power pro.

(lord help me if i ever have to reel in all that with a 1:1 ratio fly reel :D )

which brings us to the other big differance, what the reel is for.

with conventional gear you cast out the line and then reel it all back on to the reel.

rinse, lather, repeat.

a fly reels main job is to hold the line for you while you go from place to place.

while your fishing, you will pull or "strip" line from the reel and then cast it to your target, strip the line back in to a point where the fly is out of the strike zone and then you'll pick up the line w/ the rod tip, snap the tip to make it go out behind you then snap it forward to put it right back where you want it.

a good fly fisherman can make several casts to a stump for example while a baitcaster puts his bait there for a second then drags it all the way back in.

when you get hooked up your going to fight the fish with the line in your hand for the most part. occasionally you will need to "put the fish on the reel" which means all the slack is either taken out by the running fish or reeled up onto the reel so that you can use the drag on the reel to put measured pressure on the fish just like conventional gear.

most reels are 1:1 direct drive which means, one crank on the handle = one complete turn of the reel. this also means that if a fish takes off on you the reel handle will spin and it can bust your knuckles pretty good if your not careful. :D

more basics:

what is 6,7,8 weight etc etc?

the fly line has a basic physical weight to length ratio each with a different diameter. the rest of the gear is balanced to handle a certain "weight"

the value is expressed as a number from 1 to 14 one being the lightest.

what are all the hook numbers??

damd if i know but the higher the number the smaller the hook until you get to size 1 then it goes to 1/0 2/0 etc.

how do i know what size hook and tippet?

there are formulas to figure this out but if you know either what pound test tippet OR what size hook you are using you can figure out the other value.

the tippets and leaders are labeld as 4x, 5x,6x etc with the higher the number being the smaller diameter.

11,000th" diameter = 0x, 10k" =1x and so on.

(it comes from a sick attempt to avoid use of the metric system)

divide hook size by 4 and the ad 1 to get you close to the diameter you need.

ie: #6 hook 6/1=1 1+1=2 so for a #6 hook you want to start around a 2x diameter tippet, which then should be tied to a 2x leader that is tapered up to the fly line size.

check the label on the tippet to see what pound test it is and size your hook, tippet, leader combo to work with the test strength you think you need for your target fish.

i don't know if this helps you but if it does great.

it helped me to type it all out just to organize my thoughts. :D

my only real piece of advice to you is to not wait til spring, 15minutes a day of practice on good fundamentals will turn you into a decent fly fisherman in 2 or 3 weeks give or take and it would not hurt to get a lesson or 2 along the way.

an instuctor will also be able to help you sort what to get for your first rig and you'll be ready fish in the spring.

Wow what a wealth of information! Thanks! I'll probably take your advice and wait until the spring. The post spawn carp at my river hover around the top and will eat absolutely anything you drop on the surface. I just know that I will catch lots of carp on a dry fly. I have another question though. With a dry fly, do you retrieve it in short insect-like bursts or do you just let it sit there? And how do you make a dry fly float?

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Guest catdaddy

ooops i had a typo in the hook to tippet forumla

that should have read

#6 hook 6/4=1 1+1=2

i edited my post but it's still wrong in your quote..

watch this video

http://www.diynetwork.com/diy/os_activitie...2273688,00.html

read all three pages here

http://flyfisherman.com/skills/lkcastingbasic/index.html

one more thing, if i can do this then so can you

there is a whole lot of new numbers and terms to get used to but just remember when you get out on the water it's still just fishing.

re: dry flies, frankly, i don't know how to work them other than with most flies there is not really so much to putting action into them. you place the fly and let the current or sink rate do the work for you.

dry flies don't float after they get saturated but all you do is make a few false casts to dry them out and your back in business. i see dry fly dressing at the shops so i guess that makes them float also.

that leads to more subtleties regarding tippet, leader, fly combos and how they make the flies and lines react to the currents along with controling "wind knots"

wind knots happen when the fly crosses over the line it'self and then slips through the loop. pretty soon you have several half hitches in the tippet and it's time to replace the tippet and retie the fly so you don't loose that fish once you get him hooked up.

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Guest AnthonyR

I've always wondered why the LB test isnt specified with fly line. Is it because it is too strong to even worry about? What would be the test on say, a line whose weight was 7?

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Guest catdaddy

my 7wt line is 20# test therefore my backing (both dacron and power pro) is also 20# test.

i make sure there is something lighter between the fly and the fly line at some point.

ie: let's say i'm using a 12#test tippet

this way if my redfish gets hit by a tiger shark and i get spooled, when my line hits the arbor the weakest point is going to be that 12# test tippet and that is where my line is going to break. i loose the fish, the fly, and a few inches of 12# mono and then spend 30 minutes reeling in all that line.

here's a link with some good basic info on the theory of fly line construction

(obviously the site is brand specific so take the hype with a grain of salt :D )

http://www.3m.com/us/home_leisure/scianglers/

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After hearing about my great grandfather, who was an avid fly-fisherman, I decided that I want to take up fly fishing, starting next spring. (although i dont even know how to flycast) So naturallly I have few questions.

1. What is a decent low-price fly rod

2. What is a good low-price reel

3. What flies should I use for carp

4.  What flies for salmon?

Try the saltwater ugly stick . A very strong cheap rod which will handle any carp or salmon . As for reels try martin

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Guest AnthonyR

I just wanna thank everyone for all the information about fly fishing, but i have two last questions. I fish at a harbor for stripers during the summer. There is no room there for false casts, but you dont need to casts it that far to get the stripers. So how far can I expect to cast with no false casts? And what types of flies are good for stripers?

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