Jump to content
Carp Anglers Group Forums
McTage

Do The Fly-Guys Need Better Carp Handling/

Recommended Posts

So, some legitimate criticism has come up several times on the fly fishing forum. It seems that some believe that fly fishermen need to do a better job of carp-care. Issues like boga-grips, no landing mats and in-adequate landing nets have been mentioned. Good constructive criticism but it is buried inside of a forum where the only people reading it are big carp lovers and are probably doing the best that they are willing to or know how. In other words probably slightly wasted breath.

Would any carp-care experts like to do a guest post giving advice on my blog Fly-Carpin. You would have to keep in mind that fly fishermen NEVER sit down and can easily walk several miles in a single outing. Advice to carry a huge landing net or a big padded landing mat would not help. Advice on small compact alternatives to a landing mat, good collapsible landing nets, avoiding boga-grips and all the subtleties that I frankly do not know would.

Fly fishermen and Euro-style carpers share a cultural interest in fish care and catch and release. Euro-Carping is quite a bit more mature when it comes to carp though so maybe you could help us out.

Thanks,

McTage

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One of those weigh slings that have the poles along the top edges will roll up fairly compact and maybe put a suitable size sheet of bubble wrap on the ground beneath it, for a fairly compact solution. Carry a small scale to use with it, The sling could also be used for carrying some of your less odour sensitive items, hope this helps :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One of those weigh slings that have the poles along the top edges will roll up fairly compact and maybe put a suitable size sheet of bubble wrap on the ground beneath it, for a fairly compact solution. Carry a small scale to use with it, The sling could also be used for carrying some of your less odour sensitive items, hope this helps :D

Honestly not sure what you are talking about with the weigh slings, I will research it. The bubble wrap is a very interesting idea!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So, some legitimate criticism has come up several times on the fly fishing forum. It seems that some believe that fly fishermen need to do a better job of carp-care. Issues like boga-grips, no landing mats and in-adequate landing nets have been mentioned. Good constructive criticism but it is buried inside of a forum where the only people reading it are big carp lovers and are probably doing the best that they are willing to or know how. In other words probably slightly wasted breath.

Would any carp-care experts like to do a guest post giving advice on my blog Fly-Carpin. You would have to keep in mind that fly fishermen NEVER sit down and can easily walk several miles in a single outing. Advice to carry a huge landing net or a big padded landing mat would not help. Advice on small compact alternatives to a landing mat, good collapsible landing nets, avoiding boga-grips and all the subtleties that I frankly do not know would.

Fly fishermen and Euro-style carpers share a cultural interest in fish care and catch and release. Euro-Carping is quite a bit more mature when it comes to carp though so maybe you could help us out.

Thanks,

McTage

The criticism came from guys who didn't know why he used the boga-grip. And until they walk in the fly fishier-mans shoes or waders the Euro-style guys can only guess at what would work in every case. Just treat the fish the best way you can,

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have used a boga grip for carp in the past and have to say...they simply should not be used on carp. It is far too easy to rip their lips. Such an easy solution as there are many portable nets out there. I like my net, but need to get a much softer mesh in it.

One other overlooked item of carp care that flyfisherman often miss is rod weight. I know you probably see it a lot in CO Trevor...but guys will go out with three weights etc to catch big carp. That just seems crazy to me. Use a rod designed to subdue the fish...don't chase 15-25 lb fish with a two or three weight. Honestly, if it takes you "forty five minutes" (I read this on forums all the time) to land a carp on a fly rod you are harming the fish. Ther is no freshwater fish alive that should take more than 10 minutes to bring to hand...they simply do not have the muscle or oxygen to fight that long. If you have a freshwater fish on your line that long, the stress is going to kill that fish.

Landing Matts are impractical for most fly guys (I cover 3-6 miles when fishing) but we all need to be cognizant of using soft mesh nets (guilty here) and brining these fish to hand quickly. I love to catch em, and deal with enough dead fish from the bow hunters...I don't want to add to that pile.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The criticism came from guys who didn't know why he used the boga-grip. And until they walk in the fly fishier-mans shoes or waders the Euro-style guys can only guess at what would work in every case. Just treat the fish the best way you can,

Pretty much all true, but I figure an open discussion cant hurt. Lets face it, the Euro-style carp fishermen are perhaps the only fishing culture in the world truly qualified to turn thier noses up at fly fishermens catch and release methods.

John - The rod weight and "half hour battle" thing drives me crazy on forums here too. Usually it is because somebody is just new to it or caught a carp by accident. In my limited research the net thing is tough. Mine has a better mesh. Yours has a much much much better bag depth. I would love to find something in the middle, but at 50 to a couple hundred bucks per experiment its not something you can sort out by trial and error.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting topic. We have dealt with the same issue in Mexico, especially chasing big carp. Luis nowadays uses a Resistance Tackle mat. For giant fish not really big enough in my opinion, but so much better than having nothing. And let's be realistic, no fly fishermen would ever be bale to carry a giant mat. RT also carries a foldaway net that works pretty well. I think if you're chasing big fish (and you're planning to brag about it on this board :D) it's not too much effort to carry a decent net as well as a mat (even if it's a small or improvised one)

50lb on the mat...

post-1403-0-76663000-1321129745_thumb.jp

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If I could find replacement mesh, my net would be pretty ideal for a walking flyfisherman. Good size.

Ed Cumings makes any size nylon mesh replacement nets you want, if the ones in his catalog don't suit you.

I bought two 1/4" nylon mesh nets to fit my dip net a few years ago. I called them on the phone and they fixed me up for under $20

Call them and tell them the hoop size and how deep you want it to be.

http://cumingsnets.c...formation_id=11

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The criticism came from guys who didn't know why he used the boga-grip. And until they walk in the fly fishier-mans shoes or waders the Euro-style guys can only guess at what would work in every case. Just treat the fish the best way you can,

Well said. Being qucik to smash a technique that one has never tryed is only showing bad form.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is the net (Promar trophy series) I am using. Considering buying the next size up because it seems to start to be too small for anything over about 18lb or roughly 28". How it collapses is absolutely perfect, and the opening seems fine, the bag depth just isnt enough. Fortunately (or unfortunately) I dont run into to many 50lbers here in CO! My biggest so far is a smidge over 20lb. Maybe instead of trying the next size up I will try a custom bag first.

carpkit.jpg

Mario, that pad you showed in that picture looks pretty big. Does he roll it up and carry it on his back or what? That net looks interesting. Huge opening for a collapsible. Do you know what manufacturer it is?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The tick for me is how to stay portable. I cover a lot of ground. I can't see a Matt working for me. The ideal net is big, has a wide hoop and soft mesh but is not only portable (collapsible or folding) but can also be used quickly and easily with minimal fuss. It is actually pretty tough to find.

Take it from me...the boga is bad news. Small and easy to carry (plus it has a built in scale) but I sud one for a season early on in my carp fishing life and I hurt more than a few fish. Bleeding mouths and in some cases ripped lips...and i was trying to be careful and gentle. It just isn't made for carp. I think I still have mine stashed in the bottom of my gear bag.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think that as long as fly fisher keep in mind that "we must do no harm" when we fish; it will cause us to better handle carp safely.

Bill

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All i did was flyfish for over 8 years before I seriously got into carping. A weigh sling can double as a mat for fly fishermen (Resistance or gardner) and are easy to pack and roll up. Any rubberized or soft mesh net is fine.

And I will never ever use a boga on a fish

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is the net (Promar trophy series) I am using. Considering buying the next size up because it seems to start to be too small for anything over about 18lb or roughly 28". How it collapses is absolutely perfect, and the opening seems fine, the bag depth just isnt enough. Fortunately (or unfortunately) I dont run into to many 50lbers here in CO! My biggest so far is a smidge over 20lb. Maybe instead of trying the next size up I will try a custom bag first.

carpkit.jpg

Mario, that pad you showed in that picture looks pretty big. Does he roll it up and carry it on his back or what? That net looks interesting. Huge opening for a collapsible. Do you know what manufacturer it is?

Here's the net: Resistance Tackle NET

And the mat: Resistance Tackle MAT

The mat can be easily rolled up and tied to your back with a string. No big deal really. It really depends also on the terrain you are fishing. If I'd be going after fish on a river with soft grassy shores, there really isn't a problem. Here in Mexico we often deal with very dry and harsh rocky or sandy conditions and when chasing big fish you really don't have much of an alternative.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mario,

Thanks for the links, I had looked through and wasnt sure if that was the mat you were talking about or not. Not that expensive, I will probably pick one up to at least try it out. Open mind and all that. Those nets are incredible deals, way bigger than I think I need for CO carp but for that price I might even give it a shot. Right now I am picturing taking a cheap camel-bak backpack and rigging it up to strap in these straight down my back behind my head. Could work.

Mr. P,

I would love to see what you use. Looking forward to it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

McTage, thanks for starting this thread. My answers are quite involved. Please know I am not using your thread to create blog traffic. There are quite a number of pictures in my answers and I don't have time to optimize them for the CAG forum so please accept the format of my answers.

Here is an explanation of how I came to have some familiarity with Euro-Carp methods and how I learned what a weighing sling is.

Here is a detailed explanation with pictures of all of my nets and my sling.. My weighing sling works well for me as a wading, Carp fly fisherman.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The criticism came from guys who didn't know why he used the boga-grip. And until they walk in the fly fishier-mans shoes or waders the Euro-style guys can only guess at what would work in every case. Just treat the fish the best way you can,

I actually go fly fishing here in the UK and have never used one of these items on salmon or trout. Could you give me an idea as to why they are used. Over here we even did away with an item called a pike gag, a spring type gadget to keep a pikes mouth open whilst unhooking.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I actually go fly fishing here in the UK and have never used one of these items on salmon or trout. Could you give me an idea as to why they are used. Over here we even did away with an item called a pike gag, a spring type gadget to keep a pikes mouth open whilst unhooking.

Paul,

Pretty sure that boga grips (and the various knock-offs) actually originated with the saltwater crowd and that many users are using them because, well, it is hip to do what the saltwater guys do. That's basicly why I had one a long time ago. The appeal is at least partially that they provide a fairly portable tool to aid in controlling and landing a fish with the bonus that most have an integral scale that can even be IFGA certified. I think that the appeal is over-rated because they are actually heavy as hell and they really do seem to me to be hard on fish. That being said, if I ever get to fish for Tiger fish or something equally scary I would wish I had mine back!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

McTage, thanks for starting this thread. My answers are quite involved. Please know I am not using your thread to create blog traffic. There are quite a number of pictures in my answers and I don't have time to optimize them for the CAG forum so please accept the format of my answers.

Here is an explanation of how I came to have some familiarity with Euro-Carp methods and how I learned what a weighing sling is.

Here is a detailed explanation with pictures of all of my nets and my sling.. My weighing sling works well for me as a wading, Carp fly fisherman.

Thanks allot Mr P, that is a whole boat-load of things to think about. This has been the funnest CAG fly discussion in a while.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I actually go fly fishing here in the UK and have never used one of these items on salmon or trout. Could you give me an idea as to why they are used. Over here we even did away with an item called a pike gag, a spring type gadget to keep a pikes mouth open whilst unhooking.

fly fishers who fish for carp sometimes use the boca grip. they are expensive but reliable when used correctly. in addition to carp, I use flies to catch northern pike, hence the real reason I own a boca. I think it would have been better if someone had taken the time to explain why the euros use the equipment they use rather than appear to be passing judgement. euro carp fishing is different from fly fishing for carp much like table tennis is from tennis.

Here is some info from BassPro regarding the boca grip:

The Boga Grip is an ingenious tool for fishermen of all walks. Originally designed for saltwater fishing, the Boga Grip was built to safely land large fish without damaging the fish or the fishermen's fingers from treble hooks and sharp teeth. Since its induction into the fishing industry, the Boga Grip has received numerous accolades, and it's the preferred tool of a lot of saltwater guides and fishermen -- but that's not the only place its used for. Many inland fisherman use Boga Grips to land everything from trout to pike. Plus, it's perfect for the catch-and-release fisherman as they can subdue the fish, get it in the boat and weigh it without ever having to touch it and disturb the fish's protective coating -- and all of this can be done in less than a minute.

bogagrip1

With scissor-style design, the heavier the fish is, the stronger the clamps get.

Basically, the Boga Grip has stainless steel clamps that encompass the lower jaw of fish. And with the Boga Grip's design, it doesn't matter how heavy the fish is, because with the clamp's scissor-style action, the heavier the fish is, the harder the steel tongs bear down.

To see how plump your fish really is, the Boga Grips have a scale integrated into the handle, so all you have to do is lift up and you have it weighed -- the only thing left after that is to take a picture and set 'em back in the water or in your livewell.

Being that I live smack-dab in the middle of the United States, I don't get to do too much saltwater fishing, but instead I get to sate my big-fish needs by seeking obese catfish. After taking the Boga Grips out on a couple of catfishing excursions, I found that the Boga Grip was a valuable commodity to my stinkbait-reeking catfish bucket. With the soft foam handle and nylon lanyard, I found I could wrestle some fairly large catfish into the boat. And even when I had one that decided he wanted to fight, the Boga Grip's handle turns freely from the business end so the fish couldn't hurt himself when he got to wiggling around.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

McTage,

Great topic. I am with the group that says to take care of them as beat you can. I disagree with boga grips as has others. You know me, some don't. Fishing from a modified wheelchair I use a net that extends to 115". And I fish where my balance is best located, casting with my left side facing the water, and fighting fish with the right hand. I must transfer the rod to my left hand to net, what a dog and pony show. But, a large net with a rubber bag, so the fish seem none the worse for wear. A gaff, oh my gosh, don't think so.

Gregg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...